#157 - Code, Music, and Python Education: A Conversation with Christopher Bailey

Intro
I get so much excitement when especially when I was doing programming at the bank and stuff where I would build something
and the person's like oh my gosh you just saved me like three hours you know and I'm like yeah that's great that's fantastic you know and it might be like
you know ongoing like 3 hours a week or something like that and that that's what really that is definitely a motivating
thing for me hello and welcome to the pyes podcast where we talk about python career and mindset where your hosts I'm
Julian squa and I am Bob boss if you're looking to improve your python your career and learn the mindset for Success
this is the podcast for you let's get started welcome back everybody to the
pbes podcast this is Bob alos and I'm here with Christopher Bailey some of you might know from real python yeah yeah
yeah how you doing I'm doing good it's early morning here for me so it's always fun spanning these uh different time
zones yeah you're in uh Colorado zone right yep yep right in Mountain Zone
there yeah yeah recording this my afternoon your morning getting off of the coffee or getting on on the just uh
I'm just going to be drinking here in the background sometimes so fueled up right yeah that's also funny because I
was recently on your podcast and this feels now just like a natural continuation with the difference that
there you interviewed me and today I'm going to interview you so yeah I haven't done very many of these so I'm
interested to see how what kind of reaction I get out there in the community and I haven't done much video stuff either though I have interesting
background I'm thinking F people listening are going to think they're listening to a real python episode
because we so used to your voice as the host right but now yeah yeah yeah I have to stop myself and stop asking you
questions so well you can if you want but yeah it's good to be about you so uh yeah so maybe you can introduce yourself
to our Pates audience for the people that don't know you yet and um yeah we
also always start with a win of the week cool yeah well I'm Christopher Bailey I go by Chris uh and Christopher I'm not
Christopher Bailey intro and win of the week
very picky about it and I've been working for real python for about 5 years I discovered them in my python
Journey which maybe we'll talk about a little bit more and Dan was looking for people to do video stuff and I had a
background in teaching and a background in making videos and was very interested in doing that for that audience and then
four years ago almost to the month I started the python podcast I had asked
Dan why don't we have a podcast and he didn't have time and I said well I can do it and I had dabbled in doing a
podcast before that and so he helped with the sort of background and that stuff and it's been a real journey and I
have used both real Python and the podcast as a tool for me to continue learning and that's definitely what my
show's about I really like to ask questions break down acronyms and try to
provide listeners with actionable stuff they can do like I go out of my way to
have lots and lots of links on the show and and so forth yeah so if you haven't checked it out I guess this is my win of
the week I'm recording episode 200 and so that's very exciting for me kind of a
big milestone uh I have a co-host Christopher Trudeau and we're g to be recording that Friday and that'll be
coming out next week but that is kind of big I also uh did another recording this week and of course being on your show
that's kind of a win of the week for me too getting out there and being out there in the world so those are kind of my background yeah that's awesome about
200 episodes I think we're around 160 but that's that's a big milestone yeah well we'll talk about the podcast in a
bit I definitely W to want to know more about it the backstory but uh yeah maybe
we start with because you're not originally from a programmer Computer Science Background you talked about
Background and career progression
video editing music education so I'm curious to hear how you got into coding
then yeah well I got a computer very early I'm at the age when people in the
United States could still have a paper route and so I was always eager to have you know money and be able to buy things
on my own my parent I was a six of six kid so there wasn't lots of like oh showering me with presents and things
like that so if I wanted something I needed to go out and earn it and and buy it and so forth and that has always been
my kind of thing and I was very much into the idea of getting a kico vision I know that's really dating myself but
that a game console that kico put out back in the day and it was fantastic and
I saved up all this money to buy it why am I saying that is because my parents gave me the attachment that went to it
that was what was called the atom computer which basically turned it into an Apple 2 along with a really awkward
Daisy wheel printer I don't know if anybody remembers those very clacky sounding printer and it had tape
drives again reading floppy discs on personal computers at home and so forth it was a interesting computer I learned
how to program on it a little bit basic obviously made my own little Dungeons and dragon like sort of character
generator sheets and I made a kind of snake game that was a two-player that you could kind of challenge each other
that was a fun thing as it came with these controllers and so I could kind of interact with that and it was a time
when you would maybe code things out of the back of a magazine or whatever and and type it into a machine in school I
did really well and had a scholarship to go to the Arizona State University and I
was like well I'm interested in engineering and so I took electrical engineering and I hated it I I was not a
great school at the time for engineering in my opinion this is late 80s they have turned into quite the worldclass
institution in that stuff now at the time it was very very frustrating and I had discovered music and how much I
loved it at the time I decided to pursue that I formed a band in the 90s and we
toured the US and we were uh the band was called beats the hell out of me and we were signed to
metalblade records which is like a you know the only band that we were similar to at the time was uh there were bands
that were way more metal than us and we were kind of more like a grunge like early 90s heavy Rock Punk kind of stuff
and so they didn't know what to do with us and we couldn't really tour with other bands on the label so it was a very interesting thing but we did three
albums and then I kind of trying to find work and and do other things in my life
I ended up working at a music store and that kind of led to a gig where somebody
was looking for a teacher somebody who could train people about midi and keyboards and digital audio and so that
landed me a job where I worked at a place called the conservatory of recording Arts and Sciences that's in
Arizona and I taught there for 10 years I taught midi musical instrument digital
interface I taught digital audio I taught basically computers to people
that were interested in maybe not interested in computers but much more interested in Touching big consoles and
tape machines and things like that it's a weird time like the late 90s into the early 2000s is when lots of Industries
started to have that digital turnover the print world had already happened right with desktop publishing and Laser
Printers and so forth and so audio was really on the cups of it Digi design at
the time which is now Avid uh their protool software was newish and um I
remember Apple buying the logic platform and so those were things I taught logic and Protools and digital audio we
started a program and audio for video games we taught a platform called wise which you might see in games today but
it was hard it was four hours of teaching in the morning and four hours of teaching in the afternoon and I sort
of was burning out on the idea of it and I picked up sticks moved to Hawaii with my wife who grew up there had her folks
there and I worked for Apple for a while I was a trainer for them I was teaching logic which madees sense cuz I had been
teaching that and I taught Final Cut cuz I was really getting into video and that whole thing turned into you know working
in the retail stores which was interesting I enjoyed more teaching the staff uh I would teach people how to
repair iPhones and things like that I did both jobs they call it a creative job and another job they have were there
which is called the uh genius you know or back they're repairing things and that was a very interesting Journey but
retail is also very hard and I was kind of burning out on it and my wife turned to me and said why
don't you come work at my bank and I said okay what do you what do you think I can do I think you can do SQL
programming because I've been doing it and I'm like what do you mean so on the side they had hired somebody as a
contractor to do sequel programming of all these reports and the person was very slow and my wife was able to like
figure out on her own how to do these kind of reports by modifying them and so forth and she wanted to you know present
me so I dove in and taught myself SQL and this is after having you know gone through an engineering program where I I
learned Fortran and I learned C at the time and computers were really boring at
the time again this was before that big changeover where music and and video and all this other kind of fun stuff's
happening with with computers today and so I was very interested in in learning SQL and so I I went on uh Linda I don't
if you remember that platform it's now I guess LinkedIn learning now and I learned SQL there I bought books and BAS
basically did the whole sort of teach yourself everything and they sat me down to basically do a job there they were it
was a bank and we were working in the mortgage area uh mortgage finances and
loans and things and they were sunsetting an entire platform that they were using in the past they were moving
to a new one and they needed that data still accessible and they needed to be able to pull the same reports they used
to be able to pull out of it but just using raw SQL and I said okay well you have a schema right for like this
database and so forth no okay uh can you give me some like example reports that
were written no that going to be gone it's just going to be in these Ms SQL databases and so I basically taught my
SQ myself SQL from the ground up and I would mimic existing reports from you
know past documents and so forth and I had to teach myself mortgages too because like I had to learn out what what all these different forms and
numbers mean and so forth which was very fascinating and so it was a really neat way to get back into programming and and
full circle then right yeah yeah kind of yeah and then I I really enjoyed it I loveed the idea of putting headphones on
and working it was really really fun and I probably my favorite thing to do though is people would come to me and
say I want this this will make my job easier and I'm like let me solve that problem for you so there were very much
one-off kinds of things it wasn't quite Building architecture in a way so that
was different and then I got into python kind of through another job change there was a marketing job that was opening at
another bank banks are not unlike other you know sort of Industries where lots of people move between different
institutions and in Hawaii it's very much a small little community and so I moved to uh another place and they
wanted somebody that knew python I'm like I think I can learn Python and they were open to the idea of somebody who is
you know at least capable of learning on the Fly what they were doing and so I
looked at real python I learned you know from Miguel grinberg's flask tutorial I
went through that whole thing and I had it was a long hiring process so and then I actually did like a test
to to be able to you know get the get the gig I'm embarrassed at what I you know wrote at that time as far as my
python but and I became an automation engineer I was building tools for uh this marketing department and what's
weird is I learned r at the same time and because there was another apartment learning that was doing that there and
they needed other tools that would interface between it so I went back and forth between R and python quite a bit
but kind of started to fall in love with Python and and real python and then that's kind of the whole thing with Dan
he was growing real python and he sent out like an email looking for somebody who are looking for people that could
make video content and I've been dabbling in video and had been a teacher for you know a long time and what a
great way to learn right and so I jumped at the chance and so like my first video course was about FST strings anything
that was like kind of a question mark for me uh decorators was my second one I was like what are these things and how
do they work and so that was really fun to create a video course on that teach myself that type checking I did a course
on lists and tupes and and so I did like about 10 courses and then Dan kind of
turned to me and said I really like your work would you be interested in reviewing other people's work and so
that's kind of what my role turned into and then that's kind of what I've been doing less creating and a lot more
making sure the other creators putting out their best video product so it's just been interesting yeah that's quite
a journey huh yeah yeah yeah took some time there sorry no no no that's cool
there's a lot of uh followup questions I could ask just quickly the real python stuff is that that your full-time
occupation now or you yeah it's I was a contractor and so I would submit you
Real Python work and how to stay technical
know basically for the hours I spent making videos initially and then I think
it's maybe it's around the year after I started doing the podcast is when Dan was like maybe we should you know make
you a full-time employee and so yeah that's a full-time gig and we're all remote I mean it's probably not unlike
you guys uh most of the contributors and other team members there's one other person in the US with me he's a video
editor who lives in Vegas taen and had pretty big presence in Canada and then another presence in in gosh all over
Europe so there's a you know I basically am hired through a remote company but
it's full-time and got benefits which is really great I'm very excited and it was a great timing for me because that was
2019 I'd moved away from Hawaii and again having a remote job was thing that allowed me to be able to move very
easily yeah that's awesome so yeah again quite a journey from Pro neck for programming into electro engineering
that you didn't like into music complete shift and I think when you said I have
lots of stories there too you know is that is that grunch is kind of Nirvana like right yeah yeah we would be um
sound garden Nana you know B that that kind of Seattle sound we were that but imagine
the most random bunch of people that you would see at a party and somebody points at like 10 random or five random people
says oh those guys are in a band that was us you know that sounds like a really fascinating uh career option it
was interesting yeah yeah it's hard though yeah yeah yeah and then you went into teaching and then into programming
and now you're basically back into teaching yeah um so how do you combine the two because now you're more than in
in charge of of video content producing reviewing yeah um maybe less so
programming so how do you stay technical that's been kind of a a balancing act that I've been trying to figure out
right now myself the podcast is nice because I do get a chance to experiment with lots of different libraries that's
one of the types of shows that we do every other week I I do that show with Christopher Trudeau and that show is
much more water articles and news items and so I kind of pay attention to like what's happening with like certain
libraries and then often we'll pick a project that I'm interested in out of that as like a highlight at the end and
I will do everything I can to set it up and you know kind of go through some of the tutorials and and experiment and
then you know I have other things that I kind of play around with a little bit but I'm doing less architectural in these things I'm
actually kind of chomping at the bit to do more of that the other stuff is keeping me very busy no that that's uh that's great and
that answers a question as well which I had about the podcast of format so it seems like you have interviews but
then also like kind of news kind of a news thing yeah yeah bit like Pon bites
does right yeah we kind of approach it a little bit differently we'll do like a little sort of newsy segment then we'll
grab articles specifically and then when I had started it with David Amos who was my other sort
of co-host at the time we would then you know talk about a project each and
Christopher and I have expanded that to having not only the two articles each
but then a project each but we'll sometimes then have like a discussion which sometimes gets pretty more
detailed and almost turns into an interview of me of of Christopher because he has way more opinions and has
worked in the industry a lot more he's much more of a web dev kind of guy apis
but he also does training and and other things like that he's one of the other video creators on the on the platform so
yeah so that's kind of I guess the format and then you're right the every other week is like more of a an
interview like the one that we did I had a Wes mckin on recently the creator of pandas and talk about really what's
happening with data science and all the tools there that has been interesting so yeah nice nice and it seems in your
Mindset of learning, music and teaching influence
career you have to yeah you had several times you had to learn stuff from scratch not only python but also the SQL
uh job you spoke about so I want to talk a bit like the mindset about learning
and and picking skills up fast as we know is is a requirement yeah in this
space and yeah maybe also how your background in music and teaching has has
helped you there if so so I've always been fascinated with technology and I
definitely came into the music industry at an interesting time also like right when I'm getting out of high school and
getting more into like a full-time or part-time job kind of thing I this is when four track tape recorders were
coming around that were kind of a small thing you could set on your desktop and so I could write and record music by
myself and play multiple parts and so that's why I kind of guitar is my main instrument but I got into keyboards and
would program drum machines and so I got very good at like interfacing with like technology and learning how to learn
what it's trying to tell me from the front panel and I've always kind of enjoyed that sort of immersive part of it and I think programming is the same
thing for me like for like learning SQL I and voracious if there was a sequel
podcast I didn't know of it at the time but when I got to python I was like immediately was checking out like talk
python U that's why I heard about Dan at the time and I guess python btes had started up around that time also when I
was just getting going in the python world and I just anything I can do to
kind of immerse myself and so on that show very often don't slow down for the beginners uh it's very much more of an
immersion kind of thing and and at least at the time and so I would like what are
they talking about what are these tools what are these uh different Technologies they're
talking about and acronyms and so forth and so I'd have to go off and like research those things but that was kind
of fun part of it or I would eventually run into it and go oh that's what that
is that's what that combination of letters and numbers mean that you that you're speaking about and how they would
you know use things I'm very much that type of person where I dive head first
into to things and that's kind of I guess my mindset of it as I I give you a side like I I got really into video when
digital video became a thing and you could get like a digital video camera even though they were still tape you
could still connect it to like a Mac and do video editing and you know andjust it
so I would do these video challenges where you had a 48 hour time period to
write shoot edit and then basically produce this video as a contest and so
they wouldn't let you know like there'd be like a prop and uh a line of dialogue
and other things like that where you wouldn't know that until you showed up at this meeting at late it's usually late on a Friday night that's usually
where the 48 hours would come from youd turn it in Sunday night and we'd run off and write stuff and create this whole
movie and what an insane way to learn how to do editing is like this massive timeline so
it's kind of like the whole project idea you know that a lot of people I I definitely aspire to that this is
different even beyond that because if your stuff was good and was selected and
you finished they would have a showing at a movie theater and there'd be you know maybe a couple hundred people there
which was really fun and so I I I was able to get in a couple contests uh one
like a amdy award I made a I learned how to do time lapse like uh with figurines
like a Lego kind of thing and and that that one did pretty well at one of the contests we did but that's kind of my
approach is just like a challenge is is very interesting to me that's why I I'm very interested in your guys's platform
for that too like I think that's a neat way to approach things yeah no I see a lot of similarity to our approach and
and how we started because as we're talking on on your podcast where we started with Co co- challenges right so
um the immersive learning and deliberate practice is the way because you cannot really learn how to program just or
Immersive learning, deliberate practice and building for others
learn a language by reading a dictionary uh end to end right it's it's not a sequential thing best is to just learn
it from the inside out you dive in and do what we call just jet learning or just in time learning and you just yeah
just start you completely lost but you just start to you know uh look up things just as you need them and bit by bit it
starts to all make sense uh inside out right yeah and challenges are great for that because now you have a goal you
have a deadline uh there could be some competition uh with it and you come out with something to show for right which
you're talking about with the movie and it might be featured or something right so yeah yeah this is like at the dawn of
YouTube also which was really kind of interesting so I put a couple of those up on YouTube back in the day but you couldn't get any traction off of it you
know it was more like an interesting thing so yeah because people that that get stuck is usually they don't have a
goal or they just stick into the tutorial or they and then it's boring right but if you're tasked to do solve a
specific problem you care about then it's actually fun and it it seems like that that has been your experience as well then right yeah definitely yeah
that's definitely I want to add one wrinkle to that if I have this personality type that I want to help
other people there's actually this person who makes this thing about four different sort of personality types and
uh I fit into what a category they call the obliger and so if somebody asks breaks
no it's different from that it's actually just a I can't remember all the different terms but maybe I'll share the the link with you but the obliger is
what I am and if people ask me to do something I will feel obliged to do it
and the only problem with this personality type is that people can take advantage of it in some ways but I like
to build tools for people I like to help people and so that for me is more
inspiring than maybe doing it for myself so if I'm part of a team hence the uh
video the movie contest thing and so forth I I would feel obliged we have to finish we have to turn this in I invited
all these people over and they're helping me and like I can't be the one that just says I didn't have time to finish like I
don't I want to make sure that they feel it's done or this person needs this tool and it's going to make their life better
and easier and so sometimes I feel like making a project for yourself depending on your personality may not be enough if
you make a a project that you can share with others that not only show it off to them but to like that it's something
that they can use then that even inspires more out of it I get so much
excitement when especially when I was doing programming at the bank and stuff stuff where I would build something and
the person's like oh my gosh you just saved me like 3 hours you know and I'm like yeah that's great that's fantastic you know and it might be like you know
ongoing like three hours a week or something like that and that that's what really that is definitely a motivating
thing for me it that's more skill right because if it's something for you that that can also be uh satisfactory but
that's it always will be you single single user right but uh exactly yeah I have a similar experience that when I
was making a tools for the sport organization and I had this web front and all of a sudden I saw the whole team
literally saw like five monitors and I saw five instances of my page on their screens and and and they were all saying
that they were saving time so great that's amazing so if you have that commitment towards others and you're
helping them I think it's yeah double win right like and you you go further and and you get more out of your
yourself you will um what's the word yeah you will push yourself harder right because you will be more motivated push
way harder for someone else than for myself which is kind of a weird thing it's the same thing with like there's
those people that can set like a New Year's resolution and I can't I mean if I'm doing it with someone else like if I
can find a a buddy you know or whatever to sort of commit to doing something that's going to work better for me and I
just know that about myself over time and I have to watch out also though of people taking advantage of
that of of me uh feeling obliged to complete things and build things for
people um but I know it's a it's a very large number of the population that have
this uh personality they were raised well in my opinion versus people that are like
straight up Rebels or the there's a questioner is another person they have to ask lots of questions before they'll
do anything so the obliger is one of the that I don't know there's a large amount of the population and I know that that's
hard for them you know it's hard for people to like just build something for themselves you know like cooking food
like same thing like I love hosting people and making like a a fantastic meal for them I won't necessarily make a
fantastic meal for myself um if that makes sense so yeah yeah it's it's something to Balan but can also be
tremendously powerful yeah yeah yeah so a bit more about the mindset what do you
How to get unstuck when coding and dealing with perfectionism
do when you get stuck when uh deep technical challenges uh do you have any tips because that's often where people
struggle with yeah and one of those people that definitely like the walking thing and luckily the organizations I I
was at even though they were in office I I did have kind of a a free reign kind of thing so I would go take a walk and
walk around and and that definitely helps my brain kind of get past that stuff I am a teacher and I would like to
try the rubber duck thing I've never done it the the idea of having somebody else to talk to my video courses they I
would spend tons and tons of time to make them perfect which is not great and so a perfectionist is uh sometimes a a
balancing act and can be part of the block that I think a lot of people have and and so I think talking things
through again I haven't done it with an inanimate object but I've thought about that like teaching with having someone
else there so I'm thinking about doing some video courses that are like that because I think that helps me get past
this own sort of personal block that I have of making the perfect thing and not starting that's kind of one of those
things so I don't know if that completely answers your question but like that's definitely some techniques I've used oh yeah perfectionism is a is
a big thing right when I did my first course I had to edit out all the ums and A's and and stuff and
all of a sudden still do on the podcast right right and actually we we we got
back into that because we have somebody now that edits it so we we're a bit back into that but when it comes to um yeah
sometimes I especially with teaching right I like the raw format better and especially when I'm teaching coding that
people can see the mistakes because if you carefully edit all that away it becomes too polished and yeah people of
course can still learn the concepts as F strings or whatever but when it really
comes to solving a programming problem uh they need to see the process they need to see where you get stuck
otherwise it's it's not going to be very U relatable right so yeah it's definitely a balancing act and yeah
we've had courses where that's gone overboard occasionally where I've had to cut it back and say yeah I'm sorry to
say this but you practice a bunch of really fantastic stuff here but I need need you to redo this
lesson because it's just hard to follow at some point and so that that can be
you know kind of a balancing act there but I am definitely the same person where I I would rather hold not
necessarily hold somebody's hand but like be the coach next to them walking them through it um there was this whole
term and you know having the other person drive that was definitely an apple thing you know and I want it to
kind of feel that way where like I'm teaching this other person to to do it and so we have this format called code conversations where we're trying to do
more of that and I haven't done one myself but uh we have a really good one about like packaging like a kind of
simplified python packaging with by project toml which was a really great code conversation and GNA is kind of
walking somebody else through the process which was really kind of neat and the other person had their hands on the the keyboard so the student has to D
yeah exactly we had Ian was driving at that point yeah yeah no that that's better because if you just show it it's
it can be too yeah student has to type and make the mistakes then it's going to stick better
I think right yeah I think so too yeah yeah cool yeah what uh python or yeah
development Trends are you passionate about uh what things are you planning to
Python trends and what to learn next
learn about so right now I'm interested in electronics you can probably see my
crazy setup behind me I I uh apart from all the instruments yeah it was another
sort of pandemic thing is building electronic projects I like making guitar
pedals which is kind of a fun thing you can get them as a kit uh and solder them and put them all together I know this
sounds weird but this is one of the things I truly love about my wife I taught her how to solder and we would spend like a Saturday sitting there
building things together which is really really fun and definitely yeah kind of a fun bonding thing and it's cool again
when you're done to have something that you know you can play with and and build and so forth and so circuit python has
been one of those things for me I've had a few different guests on the show to discuss circuit Python and it's gosh
probably over a year now that I haven't had somebody on but I circuit python 9 just came out it has more music stuff in
it uh midi stuff sound kind of stuff which is always interesting to me they always kind of keep simplifying ways of
interfacing and Ada fruit is definitely doing a good job sort of sponsoring that to keep going which I think is fantastic
and that's where I want to spend some time and might be I don't know I'm not going to make any promises but this is
something I I'd like to make some some content for real python for to talk about but also just again kind of
scratching that edch of building something nice and any the uh industry Trends your uh following or I would say
doing the show I'm following what's happening with Wy and scripton iodide
the sort of python in the web on the internet kind of thing and I've had had Brett cannon on to talk about it and I
tried to pick his brain he's still working on the target if you will for
python to be you know like ready to go for it I'm also very interested in beware what they're doing and excited
that they have some financing too as an open source project and I'm really watching those things why uh I think it
goes back to the idea of building usable tools for other people and I didn't
mention this in my journey but one of the things I did for a little a while when I was in Hawaii I kind of did a consultancy where I was building tools
for small businesses and my friend had a small business which was a environmental science company and apple had just kind
of tied up their connections with a tool called FileMaker Pro which is kind of a
programming environment kind of a database kind of everything but what was fantastic is that you could build
something and it would immediately work on the phone or immediately work on an iPad and these were people that were
going out in the field and they were doing science you know like sampling water you know checking soil and so
forth and they were doing it all on like clipboards and stuff was getting filthy and they'd come home and this dirty
document on like a scanner and loaded and I'm like oh my God this is like how many transposition errors and how many
steps and talk about saving time so I built a couple apps for this company um that would help them in in in that
process and and it was a neat platform it was really fun to kind of learn and so forth and and again that idea of like
handing your tool to someone else um and it didn't require hosting and it didn't
require a cloud in you know instance and so forth it was like something it wasn't as great because it did run locally on
one iPad but that person could take that one iPad into the field and then we could download the data as Excel or PDFs
or what have you and uh you I created some other tools like that so that was I really you know B that stuff and so
that's kind of like I'm like python come on come on come on come on let's let's make it more on these hand computers and
so forth and so I've been looking at that stuff a lot yeah so basically at the cord comes down to how we can more
easily distribute Python and help other people right yeah definitely um I've not listened to that conversation yet so can
you and you said wasi can you quickly explain so that's basically is that python in the web in the browser yeah so
like uh probably the best example would be you know almost two years ago now is uh Peter Wang doing the keynote Pyon
yeah and py script the idea of you know python running on the web and it's using
all these other tools kind of underneath it this sort of uh web assembly which I
I heard about it like my first year of podcasting and I was like what is that you know and I had uh Arman roner on to
talk about flask and it was like kind of like his journey through that whole project and so forth and I have this
question I love to ask which is what are you excited about about in the world of python like you do uh or you know
technology and he's like I'm just into web assembly and I'm like oh what is that
and then I heard two or three other people kind of mention it and this idea of you know just code running in your
browser and being able to make applications there and so wasum is one of the terms for it um web assembly I
don't know what all acronym stands for but the the SI the Wy one is a systems interface and it basically starts to be
able to connect to the computer to Ports to interfaces to things that you would need
to be able to do more than just sort of display data or maybe enter in data as text into it and talking to Brett last
year about sort of the state of this stuff he let me know that there are lots of parts of you know Industries where
this is happening so you know how there's like embedded uh applications on televisions right now uh the idea like
oh you can have Netflix on your TV you know just built into your TV somehow right your TV is a computer and a lot of
those are Wy they're actually these uh web assembly tools that are written in this format that then it runs on this
device which is just again fascinating to me I'm like okay let's get python there and and that's kind of the stuff
that's happening in the background does that help to explain some of yeah that that totally does yeah okay cool that's so yeah that that's that's definitely
something to look into and yeah yeah yeah but again it comes back to yeah making it more distributable and and
easier its access and in the data Science World the py script is definitely that um there's so
much stuff that's sort of included there which is really great and it's something that I haven't like I talked to Peter
after the thing and I'm like I want to have you come on the show and talk to him and I've never quite gotten him on the show again so I I want to I think
it'd be a good time to do that check in like where are we at like what's going on with it and so forth and and because I think there's been a lot of
development there yeah I guess if you said two years ago yeah I remember that coming out was a big and I did a quick
demo as well using it on on our C clinic in in P yeah but then haven't really
looked back but uh yeah I remember the excitement around that and yeah definitely cool uh awesome well lastly
Books
we always uh talk about books so what are you reading or do you have a recommendation I have a a series of
books that I really like it's from an author her name is Martha Wells uh she's
written like fantasy books and other things like that but she delve into sci-fi with a series called the murderbot series I don't know if you've
heard of that it's a a really fun series it's basically following an Android that
has a lot of personality you get to hear all the sort of internal voice I listen to it in an audiobook format um there's
a new one that I haven't listened to yet and it's very snarky he's always
constantly worried about his humans and making sure that they're okay and not doing something stupid and getting themselves into trouble because he's a a
security combat model though he keeps trying to to not get into those en environments and I guess Apple has
decided to make it into a series which is uh interesting to me and so maybe that'll come out soon but uh I've
enjoyed a lot of the Sci-Fi that's actually on the Apple TV plus platform um Silo is a really good one and i' I've
uh bought those books I haven't started to read The Silo books though but yeah I love the murderbot series they're just
very very consumable you go right through them so yeah I think uh Brian Arkham was talking about that on oh cool
I have to talk talk to him about that if I'm not mistaken yeah well we'll link that and uh so that's a good tip yeah
I'm I'm reading all over the place so I don't have a specific recommendation just by keeping the diet
varied nice um cool I guess the other one would be uh Christopher judeau has a
a d Jango book that I I had I have read and then uh I wrote a blurb before it I
don't know if they'll use it or not U but he uh is it's his first book it's
called J Django in Act and it's interesting it has like an hmx
chapter which I think is really kind of fun combining jeno with that jeno one of these tools that I've always looked at
as like maybe bridging some of what that FileMaker stuff would be combining you
know database and a web interface and so forth I'm excited for that to come out soon yeah is that self-published or
Manning it's on Manning yeah it's in action sounds like Manning yeah it's
funny yeah yeah I I always think that sounds a little weird like you know know that's an Americanized thing but in
action like doing nothing oh they got their branding right right the the that I associate it yeah
yeah you totally did yeah it's still in Early Access to I think their Meep program so yeah exactly yeah cool right
um anything I didn't ask you that you wanted to share or final shout at advice again I'm super excited to
Wrap up and outro
keep doing the podcast I again episode 200 is coming out shortly so this will probably maybe be about the same time so
I'm excited about that and if people are interested in checking out those kinds of things and you know definitely come
check us out on unreal python I'm always trying to figure out how to get more engagement I'm on Twitter
still as uh digan d g GLE e a n Digi GLE
and I'm the same on on Mastadon on fadon um but yeah you type in Digi GLE you'll find me there and uh you can also follow
me on LinkedIn or what have you so feel free I've been not great about that I
think most people follow the real python account and think it's me nope uh we
have another person who's uh doing most of that work so yeah awesome yeah I will link all that uh below and I think
you're also in the pbats community right uh I am I joined just right after we uh
had our talk so yeah yeah awesome cool no you're doing a great job at the the podcast really really good stuff and uh
yeah I should say always link all the stuff so I think that that's important for developers to have all these
resources and uh yeah I listen to a few and yeah I think people come back to them you know I think it's one of those
kind of useful things chapters is another thing I I I really am a champion of yeah yeah awesome well that's great
talking today thanks for uh joining and sharing I think people will get a lot out of it and uh yeah now we have done
it we have been on each other podcast all right we did it than have a great day all
right we hope you enjoyed this episode to hear more from us go to pyite sfriends that is pit. us/ friends and
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